Article 3950 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!uninett.no!news.algonet.se!algonet!news.tele.dk!193.251.151.101!opentransit.net!wanadoo.fr!not-for-mail From: Hans B Pufal Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: TOPS-10 7.03 MIG Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 22:46:44 +0100 Organization: Wanadoo, l'internet avec France Telecom Lines: 15 Message-ID: <3AB3DB44.E04E3118@digiweb.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: agrenoble-101-2-1-165.abo.wanadoo.fr Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: wanadoo.fr 984865632 16778 193.251.69.165 (17 Mar 2001 21:47:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.fr NNTP-Posting-Date: 17 Mar 2001 21:47:12 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:3950 Thanks to the generosity of Johnny Eriksson, I received paper copies of the 7.03 and 7.04 MIGs today. I have scanned about 30% (up to chapter 6) of the 7.03 MIG and put it up at : It's pure ASCII text. I've done a first cut at proof reading/formatting. I'll do the rest of the 703 MIG tomorrow, the 704 later next week. Enjoy.... -- HBP Article 4126 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!207.172.3.44!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-255-252 From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: TOPS-10 7.03 MIG - finished! Date: Wed, 21 Mar 01 12:26:59 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 32 Message-ID: <99abf5$qjl$5@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <3AB3DB44.E04E3118@digiweb.com> <3AB517A3.53294396@digiweb.com> <3AB728E1.519AFFB5@digiweb.com> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVarrW8F9VBSlX0xk4YFZU6da4C9bpjsDXFokzE1UYc/vNdawsPBtvJ3 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 21 Mar 2001 13:48:21 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:4126 In article <3AB728E1.519AFFB5@digiweb.com>, Hans B Pufal wrote: >I have completed the 7.03 MG, it is available at > > > >Tim (Shoppa) feel free to archive a copy on your site. > > >One thng I did not duplicate was the change bars, are these mportant >enough to add? The change bars indicated the portions of the manual that changed from the previous manual. We tried to use that as a "head's up" warning to the customer. The way a customer kept up-to-date with our software changes that affected documentation was to read the change bar text lines; that way the customer didn't have to completely reread the manual to figure out what we changed that might affect his computer usage. >What demand for the 7.04 MIG? which I also received. I don't know. If there were any changes in procedures installing those REACT files might be useful. I never looked at them so I can't tell you how important those few pages are. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. Article 6340 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!newsfeed.mathworks.com!feeder.qis.net!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!uunet!dca.uu.net!ash.uu.net!spool0900.news.uu.net!reader0900.news.uu.net!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3BC60A52.64A2D217@trailing-edge.com> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2001 21:08:34 -0400 From: Tim Shoppa Organization: Trailing Edge Technology X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (X11; I; OpenVMS V7.2 AlphaServer 1200 5/533 4MB) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: TOPS-10 Commands Manual Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 21 NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.73.218.130 X-Trace: 1002848914 reader0.ash.ops.us.uu.net 8719 63.73.218.130 Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6340 Things have (obviously) been very busy here in the past month, but I hope to have roughly a dozen new tapes unpacked and available at the PDP-10 archives soon. In the meantime, I've been stacking huge piles of documents through the scanner here, and among the goodies now available is the TOPS-10 Command Manual for TOPS-10 7.01. See http://mudd.trailing-edge.com/scandocs/tops10/AA0916D-TB_TOPS-10_Commands_Manual_7_01/book.pdf for all 432 pages in one giant 11.5 Meg PDF, or feel free to browse the individual pages by clicking on the *.png files in the directory http://mudd.trailing-edge.com/scandocs/tops10/AA0916D-TB_TOPS-10_Commands_Manual_7_01/ Each individual page is in the 30-60 kbyte range. Enjoy! Tim. Article 6035 of alt.sys.pdp10: Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 From: rivie@RIvie.no.domain Subject: Re: PDP-3 prelim spec References: Reply-To: ivie@cc.usu.edu Message-ID: User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.1 (NetBSD) Cache-Post-Path: hoth!unknown@208.186.13.142 X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b5 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.186.8.4 Date: 10 Sep 2001 10:37:19 -0500 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1000136239 208.186.8.4 (10 Sep 2001 10:37:19 -0500) Lines: 20 X-Comments: This message was posted through Newsfeeds.com X-Comments2: IMPORTANT: Newsfeeds.com does not condone, nor support, spam or any illegal or copyrighted postings. X-Comments3: IMPORTANT: Under NO circumstances will postings containing illegal or copyrighted material through this service be tolerated!! X-Report: Please report illegal or inappropriate use to X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers, INCLUDING the body (DO NOT SEND ATTACHMENTS) Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 80,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news2.best.com!news-hog.berkeley.edu!ucberkeley!nntp-relay.ihug.net!ihug.co.nz!telocity-west!TELOCITY!local-out2.newsfeeds.com!corp.newsgroups.com Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6035 In article , Al Kossow wrote: >>The PDP FAQ notes that the PDP-3 was only a "paper" design, and that >>DEC never built one - but that Scientific Engineering did build one >>from the spec. Which implies that a spec does exist - or at least, >>did at one time. > > www.spies.com/aek/pdf/dec/pdp3/PDP-3_PrelimSpec.pdf > > It looks like a 36 bit PDP-1 Acrobat craps out in the middle of the last page. -- Roger Ivie ivie@cc.usu.edu -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =----- Article 6053 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!feed.textport.net!out.nntp.be!propagator-SanJose!news-in!easynews!sjcppf01.usenetserver.com!e420r-sjo4.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!e420r-atl1.usenetserver.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Zane H. Healy" Subject: Re: Newbie TOPS-10 7.03 question Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 References: <9nont9$9cq@dispatch.concentric.net> <9nq6fr$k08$5@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nr21g$sf3@dispatch.concentric.net> Organization: Aracnet User-Agent: tin/1.4.4-20000803 ("Vet for the Insane") (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.19 (i686)) Lines: 25 Message-ID: X-Complaints-To: abuse@usenetserver.com X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly. NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 17:31:56 EDT Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 21:31:56 GMT Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6053 Seth wrote: > You're right! All I had to do was edit SYS:TTY.INI (getting a painful > but fun introduction to TECO at the same time), tell it about the > lines, and set the speed to 9600. For those not familiar with TECO, I recommend trying the SED editor that is available for both TOPS-10 and TOPS-20. > I now have a fully functional timesharing system running TOPS-10 7.03! Congrats! > I really want to play around with TOPS-20 next, but I haven't found > sufficient documentation to understand how to install it. The TOPS-10 > MIG was a real blessing to have handy. Take a look at the following web page. It has pointers to all TOPS-10 and TOPS-20 documentation that I am aware of. http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html Unfortuantly there isn't enough TOPS-20 documentation for it to be easy, but I can guarentee that it is possible to get a system running with what does exist even if you've never seen a TOPS-20 system in your life! Zane Article 6058 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!news.voicenet.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!news.maxwell.syr.edu!pln-e!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews4 From: Alan Greig Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Newbie TOPS-10 7.03 question Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 12:07:00 +0100 Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 44 Message-ID: References: <9nont9$9cq@dispatch.concentric.net> <9nq6fr$k08$5@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nr21g$sf3@dispatch.concentric.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-036.newsdawg.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6058 On Thu, 13 Sep 2001 21:31:56 GMT, "Zane H. Healy" wrote: >Take a look at the following web page. It has pointers to all TOPS-10 and >TOPS-20 documentation that I am aware of. >http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html > >Unfortuantly there isn't enough TOPS-20 documentation for it to be easy, but >I can guarentee that it is possible to get a system running with what does >exist even if you've never seen a TOPS-20 system in your life! Yes, Bob Supnks's guide on these pages (parts 1 + 2) and the TOPS-20 7.1 installation guide is close enough. Also I nearly fell over when I saw * "Introduction to using the DECSYSTEM-20, originally from the Dundee College of Technology (TEXT)" also on these pages. As that's the machine I used to run! Even more surprising is it was retyped by an ex student there who now works for me with my current employer on VMS. The author credits are DEO/KLB who were Duncan Ord and Kay Black but the version online is the 1983 edition updated by myself. Think I might have printed copies of the Dundee Tech guides to EDIT, BASIC, FORTRAN, TOPS-20 advanced etc at home if. I could only find them and scan them in. In these days I was: Alan%DCT@UCL-CS.ARPA or COMPD-ARG%DCT%DDXA@UCL-CS.ARPA even earlier Had a TOPS-10 PPN before that but (shame) I can't remember it now with any accuracy. We took part in the TOPS-20 V5 field test and had online copies of *all* TOPS-20 docs from that time as part of the kit. I am still trying to track down tapes on which these might still exist.. > Zane -- Alan Article 6242 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!newsfeed.mathworks.com!btnet-peer0!btnet-peer!btnet!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!news5-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!news6-win.server.ntlworld.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3BB8CD80.82F2CE35@iee.org> From: "antonio.carlini" Reply-To: arcarlini@iee.org X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Using a REAL VT100 with simh References: <%hLt7.34042$QJ3.1202209@sjcpnn01.usenetserver.com> <9p80it$5eg$1@newsmaster.cc.columbia.edu> <3BB885F8.7D4DB51E@bartek.dontspamme.net> <021u7.7509$ib.117762@atlpnn01.usenetserver.com> <3BB8B359.AD6F3AF9@srv.net> <3BB8C10E.9D493A9B@bartek.dontspamme.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 27 Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2001 21:09:36 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 213.105.169.52 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: news6-win.server.ntlworld.com 1001967310 213.105.169.52 (Mon, 01 Oct 2001 21:15:10 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2001 21:15:10 BST Organization: ntlworld News Service Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6242 "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > I'm not sure if they're the same, but the needle-nose tip indirectly solved > the problem. When I got the terminal, and myself positioned so that I could > try the pliers I spotted two almost invisible holes. Got a tool that would > fit in them and the pegs popped right up, so now I've got access to the > guts. You can find a scan of a poor photocopy of the pocket service guide at: http://208.190.133.201/decimages/moremanuals.htm Look for: EK-VT100-J1-004 VT100 Series Pocket Service Guide I don't have the full service manual but I'm almost sure I have seen one somewhere on the net. A few quick searches yielded nothing :-( Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org Article 6256 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!feed.textport.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!nntp.abs.net!pln-e!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: Tim Shoppa Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10,alt.folklore.computers Subject: BMWSFS (Big Man With Sheet Fed Scanner) and PDP-10 doc formats Date: 3 Oct 2001 07:22:39 -0700 Organization: Trailing-Edge Technologies Lines: 67 Message-ID: <9pf6vf0j33@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-947.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News 2.90 Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6256 alt.folklore.computers:28595 OK, I've now got a fancy-pants (by my standards!) HP Scanjet IIcx with sheet feeder, and have run a couple thousand pages of old DEC documents through in the past couple days. The sheet feeder is wonderful, I can put in a stack of paper and then go out and paint the garage and come back in later to do the next bunch. And the IIcx+ADF works incredibly well with Linux and SANE (see http://www.mostang.com/sane/ ). For ordinary black-text-on-white-page documents, I just use the scanner in automatic threshold mode and I get clear crisp scans, which I can then turn into G4 compressed TIFF's or PNG's or GIF's or whatever. I can even take the whole collection of scans and make a big PDF out of them. That's all wonderful. But some of the documents (for example, the TOPS-20 software installation guide) are more complicated. They have large halftoned gray boxes (that is, the original doc has the gray area made up of a bunch of little black dots), red text, and red text in halftoned gray boxes. So far I've been scanning these in as full-color (RGB) 24-bit 300 DPI images (about 25 Mbytes per page) and then using tools to clean up these scans. I've developed some pretty good algorithms for analyzing for the presence of gray boxes (i.e. finding the halftoned areas) and cleaning up the scans of both black and red text in these gray boxes. After the 25Mbyte raw scan has been massaged, the result is a PNG that is only 70 or 100 kbytes, and I'm happy with that. I would be even happier if I could make a compressed TIFF of these black and white and gray and red images, but G4 TIFF compression only works on bilevel (black and white and no gray). If I look at the man page for 'pnmtotiff', it tells me that some TIFF encoders/decoders can do LZW compression but that this capability isn't universal. I'm unfamiliar with tools and platforms outside of what's installed on my personal boxes; is LZW-capable TIFF widespread? (I'm asking this as a practical question, and I don't really want to get into the legal issues regarding Unisys's LZW patent, though obviously they are related and the patent has limited the capabilities of at least some software implementations.) I know that others here have done scans and made the results available as JPG's, but I'm fundamentally opposed to doing any lossy compression. I also feel that JPG's are just stupid when applied to line-art type images, but I'll only say that once to not insult too much those folks who use it :-). Mostly I'm writing this just to organize my own thoughts on the issues involved, and I think I can summarize by saying: 1. I like non-lossy compression. 2. I want to use a format which is easily viewable on a wide range of platforms. 3. I'm really proud of my little piece of code that cleans up black/white/red/ gray scans. (If I ever get around to 11M+ docs, I may have to add blue!) And I think I'm asking: 1. What format is most useful? PDF's seem OK (though some PDF-printing software seems to re-rasterize my 300 DPI scans onto their own grid and the results look a little odd), and I can also make web-browsable (i.e. indexed, forward, and back) HTML indices of GIF or PNG images that allow individual pages to be viewed without downloading the whole document. 2. Is the format that's most useful for black-and-white also the most useful for black-and-white-and-gray-and-red? What opinions do folks have on "useful" formats? Do you violently disagree with any of my thoughts? That's it for this morning. Tonight I'll start putting some of my scans up at pdp-10.trailing-edge.com for y'all to see and complain about (or maybe even use!) Tim. Article 6267 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!news.voicenet.com!newshub.northeast.verio.net!verio!nntp.abs.net!pln-e!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: Tim Shoppa Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10,alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: BMWSFS (Big Man With Sheet Fed Scanner) and PDP-10 doc formats Date: 3 Oct 2001 19:43:26 -0700 Organization: Trailing-Edge Technologies Lines: 23 Message-ID: <9pgice0f7m@drn.newsguy.com> References: <9pf6vf0j33@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-046.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News 2.90 Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6267 alt.folklore.computers:28637 OK, as promised you can see my scanned docs at http://mudd.trailing-edge.com/scandocs/tops20/ In particular, see the program "timify7.c" (the seventh in my series of attempts to auto-discriminate the gray and red areas) and its outputs in the aa-4195f-tm (TOPS-20 V3A installation guide) subdirectory. My apologies for the nearly complete lack of comments in timify7.c. In that subdirectory, you'll find 25-Mbyte *.pnm's which are the raw 300 DPI 24-bit color scans, and the *.png's, which are the "digested" pages that are only tens of kbytes. In some cases - especially, say, http://mudd.trailing-edge.com/scandocs/tops20/aa-4195f-tm/out138.png the output looks wonderfully nice. In other cases, the output has lots of gray lines near otherwise black horizontal lines where my discriminating software went a little too wild about deciding what was gray and what wasn't. I have some ideas about cleaning this up, and maybe they'll happen tonight :-). Article 6299 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!feed.textport.net!out.nntp.be!propagator-SanJose!news-in-sanjose!cyclone.bc.net!sjcppf01.usenetserver.com!e420r-sjo4.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!sjcpnn01.usenetserver.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Zane H. Healy" Subject: Re: TECO Manual Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 References: <87ofnlugqe.fsf@prep.synonet.com> <3BBF242C.49883D18@trailing-edge.com> Organization: Aracnet User-Agent: tin/1.4.4-20000803 ("Vet for the Insane") (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.19 (i686)) Lines: 12 Message-ID: X-Complaints-To: abuse@usenetserver.com X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly. NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2001 19:39:14 EDT Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2001 23:39:14 GMT Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6299 Tim Shoppa wrote: > Didn't Megan Gentry once make the scans of the TECO pocket guide > available as *.JPG's? I know she made the following available, I don't know if she did any others. -r--r--r-- 1 root ftp 1904195 Dec 6 1998 gt40rc.tar.gz -r--r--r-- 1 root ftp 2366570 Dec 6 1998 pdp15rc.tar.gz -r--r--r-- 1 root ftp 1417136 Dec 6 1998 pdp8rc.tar.gz -r--r--r-- 1 root ftp 1095335 Dec 6 1998 wcsrc.tar.gz Zane Article 6296 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!newshub.sdsu.edu!news-hog.berkeley.edu!ucberkeley!enews.sgi.com!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!forum.apple.com!news.apple.com!il0502a-dhcp66.apple.com!user From: aek@spies.com (Al Kossow) Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: PDF of Tim's TOPS20 install scans available Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2001 12:13:06 -0700 Organization: Apple Computer, Inc. Lines: 7 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: il0502a-dhcp66.apple.com X-Trace: news.apple.com 1002395586 13336 17.205.24.66 (6 Oct 2001 19:13:06 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.apple.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 6 Oct 2001 19:13:06 GMT Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6296 http://www.spies.com/aek/pdf/dec/pdp10/AA-4195F-TM(TOPS20Instl).pdf I thought it came out pretty good... Tim, you might want to play with the gamma setting on scanner when you do the color scan before conversion. It looked like the contrast was a bit low. Article 6317 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: nntp1.ba.best.com!news1.best.com!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews4 From: Alan Greig Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: TOPS-20 Question/Doc's available Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 09:03:29 +0100 Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 25 Message-ID: <75v7sto6vlp51p9gbf682keu1depksf8q6@4ax.com> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: p-328.newsdawg.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 Xref: nntp1.ba.best.com alt.sys.pdp10:6317 On Tue, 09 Oct 2001 21:06:47 GMT, "Zane H. Healy" wrote: >How close is TOPS-20 V7.0 to V4.1? As in how useful are the V7 manuals if >you're running V4.1? Apart from extended addressing sections and huge updates to the available EXEC command processors there is not a great deal of difference. Most of the EXEC changes up to V7 could be retrofitted. In fact the version of EXEC that comes with 4.1 is the V5 EXEC. Should be possible to build a V7 PCL enhanced EXEC on V4.1 given a week or so worth of work. >I've got the DEC V7 manuals from TOAD: online as HTML (using >Tim Shoppa's VMS program). I'm in the process of coverting them to Adobe >Acrobat, however, my method isn't as streamlined as Tim's so I've only >gotten 8 manuals converted so far. I've got everything that is done so far >available on the PDP-10 Emulation page in the further documentation section. >http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html > > Zane > -- Alan Article 13492 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: sea-read.news.verio.net!dfw-artgen.news.verio.net!dfw-peer.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!crtntx1-snh1.gtei.net!chcgil2-snh1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!wn1feed!wn3feed!worldnet.att.net!198.6.0.7!uunet!ash.uu.net!spool0901.news.uu.net!spool0900.news.uu.net!reader0902.news.uu.net!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3C094A4C.24ECEF3A@trailing-edge.com> Date: Sat, 01 Dec 2001 21:23:24 -0400 From: Tim Shoppa Organization: Trailing Edge Technology X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (X11; I; OpenVMS V7.2 AlphaServer 1200 5/533 4MB) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10,alt.folklore.computers,comp.sys.dec Subject: Please test experimental PDP-10 site search engine Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 42 NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.73.218.130 X-Trace: 1007259797 reader2.ash.ops.us.uu.net 6615 63.73.218.130 Xref: dfw-artgen.news.verio.net alt.sys.pdp10:13492 alt.folklore.computers:75607 comp.sys.dec:22603 OK folks, many times over the past years I've promised that there are ways for me to index the thousands of megabytes of stuff in the PDP-10 archive collection at http://pdp-10.trailing-edge.com/ and that I would do this indexing when I had some spare time. That spare time happened between 4AM and 8AM this Saturday morning. The resulting "test site" is far from complete, but it does contain 7000 files (totaling about 100 Mbytes) unpacked from the DECUS LIB10 tapes (although not their abstracts!) See http://new-pdp-10.trailing-edge.com/ for what is available so far. I've used the HTDIG search engine to generate a searchable index, and it seems pretty robust in my testing. Please use and abuse the "new" site to your heart's content, as I'm planning on migrating all the PDP-10 material to it in the next few weeks, and any feedback I get early on will make the experience less traumatic for all of us :-). I'm particularly sensitive to how the site may show up under text-based web browsers, though any complaints or suggestions will be happily received. I have discovered one problem with HTDIG so far: it refuses to show the timestamp for any file from before 1-Jan-1970, although it does seem to correctly sort-by-date before then. I can't be the only site on the web with files that have preserved their timestamp from before 1970, can I? :-) If some more spare time materializes Sunday morning, I may add the DECUS LIB20 tapes and maybe the 10BACKUP format DEC distribution tapes to the "new-pdp-10" site. The DECUS abstracts (I found my old 1983 DECUS LCG catalog again! The wonders of cleaning the basement...) will probably be at least a week away. Once things settle down I plan to release the tools I use to generate the site and indices from tape images so that anyone can set up their own private searchable PDP-10 archive, if they wish. Tim. (shoppa@trailing-edge.com) Article 13565 of alt.sys.pdp10: Path: sea-read.news.verio.net!dfw-artgen.news.verio.net!dfw-peer.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!newsfeed.mathworks.com!panix!news.panix.com!panix3.panix.com!not-for-mail From: klh@panix.com (Ken Harrenstien) Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: NIA20, CI20 microcode latest versions? sources? Date: 5 Dec 2001 05:29:00 -0500 Organization: PANIX Public Access Internet and UNIX, NYC Lines: 20 Sender: Ken Harrenstien Message-ID: <9ukstc$ine$1@panix3.panix.com> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: panix3.panix.com X-Trace: news.panix.com 1007548140 28203 166.84.1.3 (5 Dec 2001 10:29:00 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@panix.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 5 Dec 2001 10:29:00 GMT Xref: dfw-artgen.news.verio.net alt.sys.pdp10:13565 In article , Eric Smith wrote: >Anyone know what the latest versions (edits) of the NIA20 and CI20 >microcode are? Anyone got sources? Even as binaries go, the only ones >I've found are in the KLAD20-AC-7.0 tapes in Tim's archive, files CI20.ULD >and NI20.ULD in: > http://pdp-10.trailing-edge.com/pdp-10/K20V7B.HTML There are two listings in the TWONKY filesystem I recently put up: in DSKA: [7,3,BOOT] KLPCOD MCR 1690 <455> 30-Apr-87 1A(724) KNICOD MCR 1512 <455> 8-Nov-85 1(171) They are not sources but rather output listings. The latter appears to be from something called ND167T.MCR[4,204] (version 167T, I assume) dated 2-Feb-84. Don't know if that was the last version, but that is what I worked from while doing the NIA20 emulation. --Ken Article: 21035 of alt.sys.pdp10 Path: iad-read.news.verio.net!dfw-artgen!iad-peer.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!fu-berlin.de!in.100proofnews.com!in.100proofnews.com!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: Patrick Scheible Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: TOPS-20 Newbie Searching for Documentation Date: 15 Jul 2003 09:53:08 -0700 Organization: Ye 'Ol Disorganized NNTPCache groupie Message-ID: References: X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.7 Cache-Post-Path: yasure!unknown@cascadia.drizzle.com X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b5 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 56 Xref: dfw-artgen alt.sys.pdp10:21035 Stephen VanDahm writes: > I feel kind of awkward posting questions that, to you guys, must seem very > simple and not very interesting. If I've broken USENET ettiquette by > posting here, please forgive me. This is a fine place to ask. > I have an account on twenex.org's public-access virtual PDP-10, which runs > TOPS-20. I'm trying to learn how everything works, but both TOPS-20 and > the PDP-10 architecture seem very strange to someone born in 1978. Does > anyone know how I can find printed (or printable) documentation? I found > a 93-page PDF file that is a directory for the TOPS-20 notebook set, but I > haven't been able to track down the notebook set itself. Are these PDF > files contraband, or am I free to use them if I can find them? If they're > legal, where can they be found? http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/TOPS-20_notebooks.html has some of the notebook set. Although not all of them are available, it looks like they've done some of the most important first. The processor reference manual doesn't seem to be in that set, but it is in the set at http://www.36bit.org/dec/manual/ If you can find Ralph Gorin's book Introduction to DECSYSTEM-20 Assembly Language Programming, that's a good introduction to the macro assembler itself, the instruction set, and the most important system calls. It was by ftp at toad.xkl.com for a while but I don't see it now. A good university library would have it. There's also a newbie users' document at http://www.36bit.org/dec/third_party_doc/dundee_pi16.txt As far as legality, there's a Digital license agreement at http://www.36bit.org/dec/license.html > I'm also interested in general historical information about the PDP-10 > family of computers, as well as the software and culture that developed > around it. Any recommendations? There's a webring about the pdp10 at http://n.webring.com/hub?ring=pdp10&id=1&hub with lots to read in its sites. > Thanks for your time, > > Steve VanDahm -- Patrick